In this article, Mark and Steve, hosts of the PBSE podcast, discuss the vital role of collaboration for couples navigating porn & sex addiction recovery and betrayal trauma. They emphasize that true healing requires both partners to face difficult conversations and embrace vulnerability, even when it feels terrifying. Drawing on personal experiences and listener stories, they explain that the deepest connection and intimacy are often forged in the hard, chaotic moments of recovery rather than the easy, celebratory ones. By confronting fears, expressing pain, and working through the struggles together, couples can grow stronger and more resilient.
COLLABORATING as a Couple in the HARD Struggle of Recovery & HealingThe article further explores how this kind of collaboration transforms relationships, allowing both partners to truly see, understand, and choose each other. Mark and Steve highlight that when couples embrace transparency and authenticity, they build the foundation for a deeper connection and trust. While the process is challenging, the rewards—stronger communication, greater intimacy, and a more authentic relationship—are well worth the effort. Through their insights, the message is clear: the hard moments in recovery are not only necessary but can lead to profound growth and healing.
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Inside this Episode:
Introduction: Facing the Hard Struggle Together
Every couple faces challenges in their relationship, but for those navigating addiction recovery and betrayal trauma, the journey can feel particularly isolating and overwhelming. Many couples find themselves trapped in cycles of miscommunication, unresolved pain, and a lack of collaboration. Yet, within these difficult times lies the potential for immense growth and healing—if both partners are willing to work together.
Mark and Steve, hosts of the PBSE podcast, have dedicated countless hours to helping couples navigate these exact struggles. Drawing from their personal experiences and the experiences of thousands of listeners, they’ve seen time and again how vital collaboration is in the recovery process. It’s not just about managing individual struggles, but about learning to come together as a team, even when the road ahead seems impossible.
This article, based on Mark and Steve’s 250th podcast episode, explores the hard truths of recovery, the challenges couples face, and how true collaboration can lead to deeper connection and healing. It is a guide for couples who are struggling, offering both hope and practical advice for how to navigate the hardest parts of their journey together.
The Reality of Recovery: Why Collaboration Matters
Recovery from porn and sex addiction is never a straight path, and neither is healing from betrayal trauma. The reality is that both partners in a relationship are undergoing their own individual battles—battles that, at times, may feel too overwhelming to bear. For the addict, recovery often centers around managing shame, building resilience, and maintaining sobriety. For the betrayed partner, healing means grappling with broken trust, trauma responses, and the difficult task of rebuilding faith in the relationship.
But here’s the truth that Mark and Steve emphasize: healing and recovery can’t happen in isolation. Both partners must commit to the process of collaboration—acknowledging their individual struggles while also working together toward a shared vision of the future.
Mark and Steve shared a submission from one of their listeners, a couple who had been working on their recovery for over a year. The husband, a recovering addict in the Dare to Connect program explained, When I first started with D2C I had a year and half of sobriety from porn and masturbation addiction. My wife and I were still struggling with communication because of her trauma response and my lack of shame resilience. D2C sessions have helped us identify these issues which has helped us to start the true healing and recovery process. We are communicating and now collaborating with each other like we never have before. We are still learning new things a year in and plan to continue with D2C for a while longer. Thank you Mark and Steve for all the effort you put into your work.
This profound share highlights a key point: collaboration is the foundation of a successful recovery process. It’s what allows couples to not only survive the hard times but to thrive beyond them.
However, this kind of collaboration doesn’t happen overnight. It requires both partners to let down their defenses and be willing to engage in the difficult conversations that have often been avoided for years. The addict may need to confront deep-seated shame, while the partner may need to express the full depth of their pain and trauma. Both are uncomfortable places to be, but they are necessary steps toward real healing.
As Mark and Steve reflected on their own journeys, they shared how they, too, had fallen into patterns of avoidance. Steve described how, despite years of working on communication and boundaries, there were still deeper issues that both he and his wife avoided out of fear of “going harder.” This avoidance ultimately limited their ability to fully heal, but once they began to acknowledge those hard topics, their recovery took on a new depth.
Embracing the Hard: Serenity in the Chaos
In popular culture, the idea of connection is often portrayed through positive experiences. We see couples finding joy together in romantic dinners, vacations, and shared celebrations. But while these moments are certainly valuable, they don’t represent the full picture of what it means to be truly connected. As Mark and Steve explain, the deepest connections are often forged in the hardest of times—the moments filled with pain, fear, and struggle.
Recovery, by its very nature, is chaotic. It’s messy, unpredictable, and often feels overwhelming. But within that chaos is the potential for something extraordinary. When couples learn to collaborate in the hard moments, they develop a type of connection that is far more resilient than the surface-level connections built in easier times.
Mark shared a poignant memory from his own recovery journey. For years, he had tried to handle his struggles on his own, believing that by keeping his pain to himself, he could protect his wife from further hurt. But in doing so, he was unknowingly limiting their ability to grow as a couple. It wasn’t until he dared to show his full vulnerability, admitting that he was scared and overwhelmed, that true collaboration began. His wife’s response—to continue choosing him, flaws and all—was a turning point in their marriage.
This kind of vulnerability is terrifying, but it’s also the key to finding serenity in the chaos. As Steve put it, “It was terrifying, but it actually catapulted us forward into a greater depth in the healing process.” When couples are willing to face the hard moments together, they create a sense of security and trust that can weather any storm.
But collaboration in recovery isn’t just about surviving the hard times—it’s about thriving within them. It’s about learning to trust each other on a deeper level, knowing that no matter how difficult things get, both partners are committed to working through it together. As Mark and Steve discussed in the podcast, this kind of collaboration builds resilience, not just in the relationship but in each individual as well.
The Hero’s Journey: Collaborating in the Face of Adversity
Mark and Steve often draw parallels between the recovery journey and the classic hero’s journey seen in literature and mythology. In epic tales like The Lord of the Rings or The Odyssey, the hero faces tremendous challenges and overwhelming odds, often alongside companions who have their own strengths and weaknesses. Together, they grow through the struggle, emerging stronger and more resilient on the other side.
For couples in recovery, this kind of journey is all too familiar. There will be moments of intense difficulty—times when the relationship feels like it’s on the brink of collapse. But it’s in these moments of adversity that true collaboration is born. Just as the hero in these stories learns to rely on their companions, couples in recovery must learn to trust each other, even when the odds feel stacked against them.
Mark shared a particularly powerful moment from his own marriage, when his wife finally opened up and said, “I’m exhausted. I can’t do this anymore. You’ve been like a sixth child to me.” While her words were devastating, they also marked the beginning of true collaboration between them. By acknowledging the reality of their situation, they could finally start working together to rebuild their relationship.
This moment, like so many in the recovery process, was filled with pain and uncertainty. But it was also a turning point—a moment when both partners had the choice to either walk away or to fight for their relationship. And by choosing to fight, they were able to forge a deeper connection than they had ever experienced before.
These moments of adversity, while difficult, are also opportunities for growth. Just as the hero in an epic tale faces overwhelming obstacles, couples in recovery must learn to navigate their challenges together. And just like the heroes in these stories, they emerge stronger on the other side—more connected, more resilient, and more deeply committed to each other.
Choosing Each Other Every Day: The Power of Vulnerability
At the core of collaboration in recovery and healing is vulnerability. It’s about showing your partner all of yourself—the good, the bad, and the ugly—and trusting that they will continue to choose you. This kind of radical transparency can be terrifying, but it’s also incredibly liberating.
Mark and Steve emphasize that avoiding the hard conversations and keeping things at the surface level might feel safer in the short term, but it prevents real growth. When partners choose to be vulnerable and authentic with each other, they give themselves the opportunity to truly connect. As Mark described, when his wife saw all of him—his flaws, his fears, his struggles—and still chose him, it transformed their relationship. “She still chooses me? Like, what? Wow,” he recalled.
But this kind of deep connection doesn’t come easy. It requires both partners to continuously choose each other, even when things are hard. And it’s in those hard moments that real intimacy is built. As Steve said, “When we face hard things, it’s scary, but it’s also the crucible in which relationships are formed.”
For many couples, the fear of being rejected or abandoned if they show their true selves can be paralyzing. But Mark and Steve argue that without vulnerability, there can be no real connection. It’s only when both partners are willing to be fully seen and fully known that they can truly choose each other. This is what the word, "intimacy" truly means—"into-me-you-see" and "into-you-I-see."
Mark shared how, for years, he had hidden parts of himself out of fear that his wife wouldn’t choose him if she saw the whole picture. But when he finally let down his walls and allowed her to see all of him, her decision to continue choosing him was one of the most validating and transformative moments of his life. This kind of radical acceptance is what builds the foundation for a relationship that can weather any storm.
The Ripple Effect: How Collaboration Expands Beyond the Couple
When couples begin to collaborate in their recovery journey, the benefits extend far beyond just the relationship itself. The skills learned—vulnerability, communication, and trust—spill over into other areas of life as well. Friends, family, and even work relationships can benefit from the deep personal growth that comes from collaborating in the hard.
Mark and Steve discussed how many couples find that as they grow stronger together, they also become more resilient as individuals. The confidence that comes from knowing you have a partner who will stand by you no matter what extends into other parts of life. Whether it’s navigating challenges at work, dealing with extended family issues, or managing personal stress, couples who have learned to collaborate in recovery often find that they are better equipped to handle whatever life throws at them.
But this ripple effect doesn’t happen automatically. It requires intentional effort and a willingness to continue growing, both individually and as a couple. As Mark and Steve often remind their listeners, recovery is an ongoing process. There will always be new challenges to face, new layers of vulnerability to uncover, and new opportunities for growth.
Conclusion: High Risk, High Reward
Recovery and healing are not easy paths, but they are worth the effort. Mark and Steve’s message to couples in recovery is clear: collaborate in the hard. Don’t shy away from the difficult conversations or the painful emotions. Embrace them together, trusting that the struggle will lead to greater connection and intimacy. And, IF your current level of safety does not allow for direct one-to-one dialogue "yet," then you may need to start this process in a therapist's office or communicate with each other in writing. The key is, GET STARTED!
The rewards of collaboration are profound. By facing the hard times as a team, couples can build a relationship that is stronger, more resilient, and more deeply connected than ever before. As Mark put it, “We are so welded together now that you could drop an atomic bomb on us, and we’d still be standing together.”
For couples in the midst of recovery, this message is one of hope. No matter how hard things get, collaboration offers a path forward. It’s not about avoiding the pain—it’s about working through it together. And in the end, that’s what true healing looks like. The process is hard, but the payoff is worth it—a relationship that is not only restored but transformed.
Learn more about Mark and Steve's revolutionary online porn/sexual addiction recovery and betrayal trauma healing program Dare to Connect
Find out more about Steve Moore at Ascension Counseling
Learn more about Mark Kastleman at Reclaim Counseling Services
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